Posts by Juan Viejo2

28

Well the JWC@fe is no more...

by serenitynow! in

jw
friends

i tried to find it, but it's gone.

as well as the jehovah's witness fb page.

it seems in the recent weeks those sites became "overrun" with apostates and were no longer encouraging.

Juan Viejo2

Ziddina,

Go to Yahoo Answers to get your daily doze - oops, I meant dose - of "banal chatter."

I go there every so often whenever one of the questions shows up on my Google alerts. The usual form is like this:

"Q: Why do Jehovah's Witnesses look forward to a promised paradise New Earth after the war of Armageddon?"

Why would anyone besides JWs (or ex-JWs) even go to such a question?

The first few answers are usually composed of quotes from some Watchtower or a JW study book. Most are simply made up of scripture quotations pulled right out of the publications with exact punctuation (even including the original brackets and ellipses).

When an ex-JW or apostate jumps in you'll typically see a change of direction. Sometimes scriptures are quoted, but more often than not the answer includes an appeal to reason. Often there are also references to discarded JW teachings from several years before.

If the discussion continues for any length, you begin to see name calling directed toward the ex-JW contributors. Once in a while, you will see some totally illogical attack on a JW contributor that is nasty, profane and completely out of context with the discussion. My guess is that those are setups by JWs to appear to be "persecution" directed toward the Witnesses. The apostates I know wouldn't waste their time calling people names like that.

In most cases, the discussion ends after about a dozen comments. Surprisingly, some non-supporting answers are chosen as the best, but most of the time the first one that toes the Watchtower line becomes the winning comment.

I've heard from some of my insider sources that many JWs, especially younger JWs of high school and college age, are using Yahoo Answers and the similar Topix forums as a way to count hours toward their service time. In fact, one "friend of a friend of a JW" told me that they've heard conversations around the KH parking lots where several young people were bragging about doing just that. They'd actually tell their friends that they would put up a question about "X" and that all their friends should log in to the Answers site and answer. That way they could all count service time.

Amazing. Too bad the Internet machine didn't exist when I was a kid. I could have pioneered without putting so many long, hot miles on my bicycle with my bookbag strapped to the luggage rack. I could have just jumped on my laptop for an hour or two each day and I would have easily qualified as a new version pioneer. In fact, I'd probably be on the Gubning Booty right now, giving you all orders and being directly inspired by J. Hovah (or saying that I was).

JV

30

BOE LTR PDF Nov 17- Notation made to ks10

by yknot in

(( hardcopy link of boe ltr pdf : http://www.sendspace.com/file/1gncdo ))... in my best 'theocratic' voice trying to mimic a service meeting conductor (giggles) ..."if you have acrobat you can insert this behind the other boes in the ks10 pdf, or if not consider downloading and keeping it in the same file as your ks10 for future need to know..... i chose to 'highlight' what i thought might be of interest to the forum in the below transcript but of course it is not limited!.

to all bodies of elders.

re: letters of introduction.

Juan Viejo2

TYVM!

23

"The Return of Jonny the Bethelite"

by koolaid-man in

jw
friends

the conference call from saturday night went great; with returning guest "jonny the bethelite".

he is making quite a stir on the conference call!.

if you missed it, the call is up on the site.. we also have a newer, simpler and user friendly site.

Juan Viejo2

Much improved, Rick! Far more welcoming. The technical aspects are great, but the colors (black, dark gray, scarlet) are still a little foreboding and make reading the smaller text more difficult, especially the red text over the gray backgrounds.

Over all - a big improvement. Nice work by your webmaster, whoever that might be.

JV (exjwdotcommie)

43

Can you recommend some movies/videos?

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

an ex-jw meetup group i attended just watchted worlds apart together and the host wants to do this type of thing more often.. i would love to see religulous, but the group would be divided on such a movie.. i suggested the documentary, jesus camp and september dawn.. do you have any suggestions i can pass along?.

Juan Viejo2

"Friends of God" and "The Trials of Ted Haggard" by Alexandra Pelosi are excellent documentaries and really expose the shallow and hypocritical lives of evangelicals.

Oh, yeah, and "Constantine's Sword."

30

Can't help myself! Have to share this pic! LOL!!!!

by coffee_black in

jw
friends

this is bailey 2 1/2 (the big sister) and zoey who is almost 4 months old, my youngest granddaughters.

is zoey sending a secret message?

look closely!

Juan Viejo2

It's almost like she's saying, "Hey JWs! Here's to your spanking room!"

22

Don't know how to leave: FADE or DA letter?

by porfiada in

hi folks.

i wondered if any of you ex elders can help me to figure out what my status is and therefore how to log out from the borg.

i was baptized at 15, faded at 18. never heard anything from the elders after their first visit, which wasn't about a big deal and had no conclusion.

Juan Viejo2

Cameo,

A religion has no legal authority over anyone, not even its own members. Where did you get such an idea?

Are you saying that the Watchtower Society can take you to court and say, "Hey, this person was baptized and took the two question oath in 2003 at the convention in Branson, Missouri. Therefore we have sovereignty over this person."

Yeah, right. I'd love to see that case on Court-TV. They only have legal authority as a corporation, but even the Bethel boys and girls can tell them to go pound sand and walk out the door. Is the WT going to sue them for failure to fulfill an employment contract. For what? Less than $100 per month?

Benny Hinn is a charlatan. Jan and Paul Crouch are charlatans. They are all charlatans! They get away with it because they do hide behind the separation of church and state in the USA. But hey, they got Swaggart. They got the Bakkers. They can get anyone they want if there is enough evidence that they are cooking the books.

If the Watchtower continues to do what they are doing now - or if they go over the line and intimidate some elderly person into passing their wealth to the WT and leaving their kids out of the will, they will get caught and pay the price.

If the government can send ex-congressmen and ex-senators to jail (Tom DeLay, for example), they can break the back of a religious organization if they really want to. The US government has so much on its plate right now, they simply do not have the resources. But the day may come...

17

The longest prayer ever done scenario

by asilentone in

what if a deaf brother sign the longest prayer ever recorded like one hour or two hours, do you think the audience will disappear before he signs amen?

.

Juan Viejo2

As a JW kid I can remember Sunday night Watchtower study. I used to worry that they would ask a couple of brothers to say the closing prayer because they always droned on and on forever.

Sunday night had Bonanza, Alfred Hitchcock, and Twilight Zone on TV in our area. If the meeting ended on time, we could see the last 30 minutes of Bonanza and the all of the other two shows.

One night, when I knew that one of my favorite episodes of Alfred Hitchcock was coming on (saw it in the TV Guide), I heard the words that meant my evening was trashed.

"Brother Wysocki, will you close our meeting with prayer?" Since it was so rare that he was ever called upon to pray, when he was, he made sure that he got his fair share of time. One of his prayers lasted nearly 30 minutes.

Brother Wysocki claimed to be one of the "anointed" - and so was his wife. But he held no servant's position and no one paid any attention to him. The word was that he and his wife survived the Holocaust because they were Polish. But we didn't know for sure. Whenever he was called upon to pray - you could hear everyone in the whole Kingdom Hall let out a collective moan. His prayers were unintelligible because of his accent and went on forever. I remember that one time when we were standing for prayer, one sister fainted and had to be carried out of the Hall to be revived. Wysocki just continued on for another ten minutes. The rest of us all wanted to go out and give the sister mouth-to-mouth. I would have been willing to give a corpse mouth-to-mouth that night.

JV

52

Tried to end my "bible" study, ended up agreeing to go to the Kingdom Hall instead!!!

by KristiKay in

my jw came over yesterday with a video she wanted to show me, i forget what it was called but it was about the history of the watchtower.normaly i don't have a problem discussing the bible with her, but i just could't sit through this bs video.

i already know the history of the watchtower,.

and it certianly isn't what this video was going to portray.

Juan Viejo2

Bohm,

I love your idea. I think you are on to something.

JV

11

A few questions for lurking active elders, former elders & MS

by onemore in

jw
friends

here they go.... 1) let say that you were a sincere believer of the watchtower, and fallowed the gbs direction because you truly believed that they were guided by the holy spirit.

what information or action would have made you doubt the validity & authority of the governing body?

2) what type of information would have made you reconsider your position as an executioner of the gb rules & regulations?

Juan Viejo2

I remember watching the late Dr. Gene Scott on TV back a few years ago. When I was bored, I'd grab a beer and some nuts and start flipping through the channels late at night to find him. He was always somewhere on the TV box. He always put on a good show.

One night he started "teaching" his flock about the Great Pyramid of Giza. I could have sworn he had a copy of C.T. Russell's "Studies in the Scriptures" sitting on the table next to him. He rambled on about the length of each hallway and access point in the Pyramid - often reading right from the book next to him. I swear it was SitS! Then he'd get up and go to his invisible blackboard and start drawing unintelligible scribbles and talking gibberish the whole time. His followers, sitting in the audience were all taking notes and drinking the kool-aid. Occasional applause would arise as he'd make some ridiculous assertion.

The whole thing reminded me of a small circuit assembly listening to the DO read off one of the latest talks from the GB. Only Scott was far more interesting and entertaining. When he was done, he'd put his sunglasses back on, sit down in his chair, light up his cigar and order his band to play the same song over and over again until a certain amount of donation money showed up on the tote board located in the corner of the screen. The 800 numbers were always on, throughout the whole performance.

I think Scott was really channeling guys like Russell and Rutherford. The "great bearded teacher" who took shit from nobody. His flock kept growing (thanks to his daily shows constantly on both regular TV and satellite). He was in trouble with the FCC so many times I lost count. Did he try to hide anything? Nope. Paraded his show horses and his equestrian daughter on videos that ran whenever he took a break. Didn't care if you believed him or not as long as you called in more money with your credit card.

I think that is the direction that the GB is heading. "Hey. This is what we teach. You will believe it or your out! In? You do what we say - to the letter and send us money. Out? Fine. You lose your family and we keep 'em. Years of tears for you, buddy!"

I really see that as the direction the WT will go toward. Unfortunately, they still won't be as entertaining as Gene Scott. He was playing the fool. They take themselves too seriously.

JV

69

Could ''boredom'' at the Kingdom Hall be one reason why some members leave?

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

you'll find boredom where there is the absence of a good idea earl nightingale quotes (us motivational writer and author, 1921-1989).

let's forget that most members leave due to the wrong beliefs,doctrines and practices of the wts!.

i was bored out of my mind from the repetitive: talks,prayers,ministry school demonstrations,field service talks(peddle magazines),assemblies,special talks and watchtower magazine study articles.

Juan Viejo2

One thing that my Kingdom Hall did during the late 1950s was to hold the Sunday public talk and Watchtower study at the big park in Riverside, CA. In those days, Fairmount Park was a great place to go, with a lake full of lily pads and ducks, paddle boats, canoes and row-boats. It had a small arcade and a public swimming pool. What we used was an old amphitheater located off the to the side, about 100 yards from the swimming pool.

This idea was actually suggested by a new Circuit Servant [now Circuit Overseer]. He was a pleasant fellow with a lot of good ideas as to how to increase our field service times (45 minutes before Tuesday night book study) and holding the public talks in areas where passersby could stop and listen. The park was perfect for that purpose.

Our Congregation Servant, Brother Rogers, was a respected plumber and contractor in the area. He had made a lot of friends down at City Hall. So he negotiated an eight-week trial during the summer months (except holiday weekends) to let us hold our Sunday meetings in the park. A certain number of us would commit to going to the park and being the audience. Those that could not go or were otherwise disabled, etc., would go to the regular meeting later that evening at the Kingdom Hall.

Because we were at the park, we were allowed to dress casually. No swimsuits or shorts, but jeans and tennis shoes and short sleeved shirts were OK. We didn't want the people at the park to feel uncomfortable coming over and joining us. Some of us younger brothers would hand out handbills to our next public talk. Older Watchtower and Awake! mags were laid out along the back row of folding chairs or the concrete wall to offer to park visitors.

After the meetings, which were shortened somewhat, we would pack up the literature and the folding chairs and put them in a pickup truck. Then we would all go play catch, go to the lake and watch the ducks, romance our girlfriends - whatever. We loved the summer Sunday in the Park meetings.

You can guess what happened. Someone higher up the WT chain heard about what we were doing and the programs were shut down after just four or five Sunday meetings. My father told us that because this was not authorized by Bethel HQ, we couldn't do it anymore. The CO disappeared and I heard that softly written letters of reprimand were sent to Brother Rogers and the other main servants.

We never had single complaint. We had no hecklers. We passed out a lot of handbills and older magazines. The young brothers doing that work were allowed to count an hour on their service report - as did the public speaker.

After that, there was no joy in Riverside. That may have been the best four weeks of my childhood as a JW. Figures the WT leadership would put the kabosh on such a good idea. I think the idea of making meetings "fun" went against the grain for them.

Did any other Kingdom Halls ever hold public talks in parks or other areas that would allow them?